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Post Number:#16  PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 6:24 pm 
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Location: East Tennessee
goglio704 wrote:
I found a company in Taiwan which claims to offer an LD28 timing belt tensioner. I have contacted them by email. I'll post results if and when I get them. Their part number is BT-10528.

http://www.automotivebearings.net/


I got an email that this has shipped. I've never ordered anything from the Orient before. Seems a little exotic. 8) From the picture on their website, I won't be surprised if the roller is plastic. Not my first choice, but we'll see.

I'm still very interested in the replacement axle and bearing, but it might be smart to check with this guy before putting too much effort into it.

http://www.rpmrons.com/nissantiming.html

80% of the way down this page he lists a T60096 "tensioner bearing assembly" for the LD28. He also sells belts and tensioners as sets. I found this after I found the folks in Taiwan, or I would have checked with them first. He could be simply reselling Taiwan parts, or he could be doing low volume production work. We won't know till we ask.

I still have at least 2 core tensioners available for the "Savage improved LD28 tensioner" project.

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Matt B.

83 Maxima Sedan, LD28, 5 speed, white, 130k miles. My original Maxima.
83 Maxima Sedan converted from gasser, LD28, 5 speed, 2 tone blue, 230k miles
82 Maxima Sedan, LD28, 3 speed auto, 2 tone Gray/Silver, 140k miles
81 810 Sedan, LD28, 3 speed auto, rust, rust, and more rust!

2005 Jeep Liberty CRD


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Post Number:#17  PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:46 pm 
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I'd be curious to find out more about what this guy (shop) is doing.

Like you say Matt, importing or LP mfg.???????

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Ben Martin

'81 Datsun 810 Maxima Wagon - DIESEL(For Sale)
'81 Datsun 810 Maxima Wagon Parts Car - DIESEL(SOLD-Scrapped)


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Post Number:#18  PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:38 pm 
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goglio704 wrote:
goglio704 wrote:
I found a company in Taiwan which claims to offer an LD28 timing belt tensioner. I have contacted them by email. I'll post results if and when I get them. Their part number is BT-10528.

http://www.automotivebearings.net/


I got an email that this has shipped. I've never ordered anything from the Orient before. Seems a little exotic. 8) From the picture on their website, I won't be surprised if the roller is plastic.
Image


It does look a bit too black, doesn't it? Unfortunately, on blow-up, the reinforcing ribs are evident:
Image
If replaced at every belt change, plastic might work OK. The price is certainly right, even at $40.

Quote:
I'm still very interested in the replacement axle and bearing, but it might be smart to check with this guy before putting too much effort into it.

http://www.rpmrons.com/nissantiming.html

80% of the way down this page he lists a T60096 "tensioner bearing assembly" for the LD28. He also sells belts and tensioners as sets.


I fired off an email to Ron's Precision Machine with a couple of Qs and links to a picture so it can be positively ID'd on their end.

Quote:
I still have at least 2 core tensioners available for the "Savage improved LD28 tensioner" project.


I'm up to having four jobs at my local machine shop, and they are severely overloaded with Navy work right now, but are trying to accommodate me. I'm having another low-profile compression tester adapter made, so I'll have one here whilst the other is out on loan. They're doing a pan mod on my '93 Aero A4LD transmission. And they're going to do some sandblasting and painting of a generator frame I'm having fabricated by someone else. I don't know if I can slip in another job right now, but since I'm going there tomorrow to install a new front door deadbolt and entry leverset, I can ask.

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Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.


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Post Number:#19  PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 9:22 am 
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Got a reply from RPM:
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Al,
I just called my supplier in Washington (state) and they no longer have the timing set or tensioner assembly. There is no time frame as to when they will be available again. I do not know where to send you to find what you need.
Good luck in your search,
Ron LeMmon-Pres.-RPM


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Post Number:#20  PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 3:21 pm 
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Ordered an SKF 5203-2RS brg today from Kaman Bearings in Everett (North Seattle, to you folks out of the area). $42 + freight for one -- this is not a Chinese bearing, and online bearing supplier prices aren't all the much better than retail, so I went with someone I've dealt with before.

5203 = 17mm x 40mm x 17.5mm.

The OD matches the 6203. The ID will be the fab'd axle dia. The width is quite a bit wider (17.5mm vs. 12mm) to accommodate the double-rows of ball bearings in the 5203. I have ~19.3mm available in the OEM roller.
Image


Last edited by asavage on Mon Oct 01, 2007 9:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post Number:#21  PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 11:02 pm 
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Got the 5203-2RS.

Matt, can you measure the clearance between the rear of the roller's flange and the topside of the bracket? I forgot to measure mine before I took it apart, and it's too late now.

Probably something less than .205" .


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Post Number:#22  PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 8:10 am 
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I'll be happy to, but it won't be until the coming weekend. I'm on week two of a (hopefully) two week startup - 200 miles from home. :x

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Matt B.

83 Maxima Sedan, LD28, 5 speed, white, 130k miles. My original Maxima.
83 Maxima Sedan converted from gasser, LD28, 5 speed, 2 tone blue, 230k miles
82 Maxima Sedan, LD28, 3 speed auto, 2 tone Gray/Silver, 140k miles
81 810 Sedan, LD28, 3 speed auto, rust, rust, and more rust!

2005 Jeep Liberty CRD


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Post Number:#23  PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2007 10:27 pm 
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Hmmm, I wrote a post here yesterday but apparently didn't Submit it.

I worked around the missing measurement, Matt.

Gave a drawing to the machine shop Monday, they built it today -- picked it up with two other jobs they had for me, they billed me for all of them together, so I'm not sure what the tensioner job cost by itself, but it looks about $160 -- approx. two hours shop time. Got it back to the shop, shaft fit turned too loose by about .005", so they're doing the job over (free). Half my fault for not noting a dimension as "bearing fitment" so std practice is +- .005", half their fault because when I turned in the drawing I told them specifically that it is a brg fitment. It looks quite good other than that. I have to round up some Truarc 1116 retaining rings (harder to source than I thought, at least in qtys under 500), then I'll mount it all up and take pictures for all.

As it sits, if I continue to have this shop make these, and continue to use premium SKF 5203 brgs, this will be a $250 tensioner -- though it's a "lifetime" design that would never need to be replaced -- and the brg is separately serviceable if I'm wrong. If I like this design (there are other ways to do this, and a single-row brg would shave $20-30 off the price), I'll have ten or twenty shafts made up and TIG them as cores become available. This will drive the price down considerably, as setup is the major cost and unit cost can drop from doing multiple ops in a row.

I'm using Donations money to fund this project.

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Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.


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Post Number:#24  PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 5:58 pm 
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Nice work Al, looking forward to pics. I have three cores when you're ready for them. I received my tensioner from Taiwan. It came in very quickly, but I was out of town when it arrived. It is exactly what their picture shows - and the roller is plastic. The bearing is molded into the roller. For the money, I don't think it is a bad option. The bearing has the letters SKF on the seal, but I can't verify that it is an SKF bearing.

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Matt B.

83 Maxima Sedan, LD28, 5 speed, white, 130k miles. My original Maxima.
83 Maxima Sedan converted from gasser, LD28, 5 speed, 2 tone blue, 230k miles
82 Maxima Sedan, LD28, 3 speed auto, 2 tone Gray/Silver, 140k miles
81 810 Sedan, LD28, 3 speed auto, rust, rust, and more rust!

2005 Jeep Liberty CRD


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Post Number:#25  PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2007 8:13 pm 
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After a lot of phone calls (two to TruArc), I found a distributor that has the heavy metric snap rings in stock and I don't have to buy 2000 of them to get thirty. I'm not making that up, one distributor has a minimum qty. of 2000 for the size I spec'd. I called TruArc up directly and told them what I thought about that -- told them I was not going to spend four hours calling every one of their distributors to find the one that has stock. My attitude didn't seem to cut much ice with the salesperson.

Armed with the TruArc part number, I found a supplier who can substitute a different brand/dimensionally identical part. Coming from Kentucky, should see them early next week.

I suppose I should head down to the machine shop and find what they've done in the past week.


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Post Number:#26  PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 10:56 pm 
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Got the external retaining rings today:
Image


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Post Number:#27  PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2007 1:26 pm 
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A core tensioner I picked up at a JY last weekend is bad: noisy/growly brgs. Worst one I've seen from an LD. Car showed less than 160k on it.

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Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.


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Post Number:#28  PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:35 pm 
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Since the Q has come up again about this, I should update.

I went to assemble the prototype, found the yet another error in the shaft I had made. I had specified ring groove width of .056", actual as received from them was .042", quite a lot off. I dropped it back at the machine shop Fri. AM, they are looking into it. Personally, I think this is the last straw for me with them.

I've found an outfit that will make these axles for me for a unit cost of under $20 each, if I buy (30). I'm going to write the check this week and do it. It was nice being able to buy them from Nissan, but those days are apparently over.

Ballparking the costs:
  1. Obtain core
  2. Remove old axle/brg, press brg from shell
  3. Clean base & shell
  4. Send base & axle to welder for TIG
  5. Debur/cleanup of weld, check perpendicularity
  6. Paint base and welding
  7. Press new brg into shell
  8. Press brg onto axle
  9. Install external retainer ring
I can't afford to buy enough brgs to obtain a qty discount, so they will remain at ~$50 ea. Axles will be ~$20 ea. after shipping, in quantity. I am budgeting $35 per axle for welding -- it might be half that, but there is always a minimum charge and I don't argue cost with professionals who do what they do well. Because I do not have twenty cores, I can't get a qty discount on the welding, so that's that. And there's wastage: ruined axles, bad welding that destroys axles or base plates, parts that can't be aligned, that kind of thing. Have to figure that in to the total. Plus the prototype cost, which is well over $300 by now.

To recap: the remanufactured tensioner uses a quality, non-Chinese sourced SKF bearing with two rows of brgs. The wear rate in this application will be nil. The brg is a light press fit and can be replaced later if you choose, but I expect it to last "forever" WRT to the expected useful lifetime of our LD28s. The brg is a std, off-the-shelf unit, so it won't go out of production. The retaining rings are of the "heavy" series, not that there is any axial load, but I don't like wimpy retainers and the cost is pretty low on this part. The zinc plating on the base plate is shot when it's welded, but regular paint is fine to retard rust in this area.

I am pricing these at $160 ea. for the time being.

Core charge is $20 -- send me your old one! Must have a non-bent wheel (the part that the belt rides on).

I will buy cores (ie if you are not purchasing one of my reman units) at $5 plus shipping cheapest way. With or without bent wheels.

No tax of course -- I do not have a business license (yet), and the amounts involved are low. If that changes, tax will be collected.

_________________
Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.


Last edited by asavage on Fri Feb 29, 2008 6:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post Number:#29  PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 6:01 pm 
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Prototype is finished:

Image Image Image Image

The axle protrudes beyond the idler wheel ~.095". I have to install it to determine if that will contact the belt cover, but I cannot imagine that it would.

That third picture might look as if the base is angled, but that's an illusion. It's square.


Image Image

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Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.


Last edited by asavage on Thu Oct 25, 2007 7:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post Number:#30  PostPosted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:02 pm 
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I like it Al. If it will help the cause, I can check for clearance on my parts motor. I need to pull an injector anyway. :wink:

_________________
Matt B.

83 Maxima Sedan, LD28, 5 speed, white, 130k miles. My original Maxima.
83 Maxima Sedan converted from gasser, LD28, 5 speed, 2 tone blue, 230k miles
82 Maxima Sedan, LD28, 3 speed auto, 2 tone Gray/Silver, 140k miles
81 810 Sedan, LD28, 3 speed auto, rust, rust, and more rust!

2005 Jeep Liberty CRD


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