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Post Number:#1  PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 2:32 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:55 pm
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Location: New Zealand
Im in the process of cleaning my IP due to water getting in and milk coming out and no start... I have a few questions which I'd be very happy if you could answer.

Once I'd removed the IP, I discovered the location of some wires which I'd always wondered about - wires going to the rev sensor - there'd been a cable coming from the front part of the IP mounting, not hooked up to anything. With some research I decided this must be the rev sensor. As its been disconnected, it could be that its gone bad and someone else has removed the problem. How would I test this, and where would I connect it to to start using it? My reason for thinking it would be better connected is that I have plenty of black smoke on hard acceleration.

Secondly, Ive taken the top off my IP and been soaking it in vinegar, Im noticing with horro that its becoming more rusty not less... is this normal? will it go away with more soaking?

Thirdly, a bit of identification... near the water pump on the engine there is an electrical connection with rubber housing, Ive searched the manual but can't figure out what this is for, but do know which wires to reconnect it to. Could anyone tell me what this is for?

Lastly, I thought my timing wasn't right after a mechanic installed a new timing belt, with reading about timing I'm starting to think that as the cold start device wasn't disengaged when the timing belt was installed that this could have advanced the timing a bit and would explain the high idle symptoms I have. What do you think?

THanks for any help

LD28, Diesel Kiki pump


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Post Number:#2  PostPosted: Sat Nov 01, 2014 10:30 am 
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Location: Oracle, AZ
Quote:
Im in the process of cleaning my IP due to water getting in and milk coming out and no start... I have a few questions which I'd be very happy if you could answer.
Then:
Quote:
Lastly, I thought my timing wasn't right after a mechanic installed a new timing belt, with reading about timing I'm starting to think that as the cold start device wasn't disengaged when the timing belt was installed that this could have advanced the timing a bit and would explain the high idle symptoms I have. What do you think?
Is it running or not? You may have to do the timing again.
Quote:
Secondly, Ive taken the top off my IP and been soaking it in vinegar, Im noticing with horro that its becoming more rusty not less... is this normal? will it go away with more soaking?

What top? Can you make a picture?
Quote:
Thirdly, a bit of identification... near the water pump on the engine there is an electrical connection with rubber housing, Ive searched the manual but can't figure out what this is for, but do know which wires to reconnect it to. Could anyone tell me what this is for?

That could be the connector for the IP potentiometer, part of emission control.

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Astro Van with LD28 propulsion
'84 Mercedes 190D 2.2L 5-Speed Manual purchased 06/12 SOLD 06/13
'86 Ford Escort Wagon Diesel MT Sold 07-17-08


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Post Number:#3  PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 8:50 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:47 pm
Posts: 87
Location: Peyton Colorado
There should be no corrosion or rust anywhere in the IP, this would occur if the water contamination was in the pump for a length of time, if so then I would guess a complete overhaul of the pump would be needed.

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Post Number:#4  PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2014 7:42 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2013 11:55 pm
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Location: New Zealand
Thanks for your replies

No its currently not running, due to milky fluid (from water!) in the IP, Ive removed it and have soaked and solvented it as much as I can. I'd filled the IP with vinegar to help remove any rust (and noticing more rust appearing inside the IP).

Prior to this issue with the no start and milky fluid (and winter with lots of rain and a leaky filler cap) it had been running but with a fast idle - idle screw almost to the end of its position) the sound of marbles in the engine, black smoke on hard acceleration. A new timing belt was installed a few months back which increased the idle and sound of marbles in the engine, it also seemed a bit rough and like it was overfuelling.

For me this project is a learn as I go along, reading and learning. Im wondering if the fast idle was influenced by the cold start mechanism not being disengaged?

Also, as the engine is an auto transmission, and a manual box has now been installed Im wondering whether the full load speed screw would be calibrated for an auto, and wondering should I turn it down a bit?

I hope thats a bit clearer to understand.


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Post Number:#5  PostPosted: Mon Nov 03, 2014 1:30 am 
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Location: New Zealand
Hello again, yet another question. After removing coolant pipes to the Cold Start Device and cleaning out the 'gunk' I have just learnt this is not gunk but wax. Is it possible to put another wax pellet in? is there an alternative fix?


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Post Number:#6  PostPosted: Mon Nov 03, 2014 10:14 pm 
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Location: Oracle, AZ
Look for another IP. This one is done. Wax in the coolant? :roll: Could'n imagine for what purpose. You may have other issues with the engine.

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Astro Van with LD28 propulsion
'84 Mercedes 190D 2.2L 5-Speed Manual purchased 06/12 SOLD 06/13
'86 Ford Escort Wagon Diesel MT Sold 07-17-08


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Post Number:#7  PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2014 6:50 am 
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I agree with dieseldorf.

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Post Number:#8  PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 2:41 pm 
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It turns out the 'electrical connector; I mentioned before is most likely the oil temperature sender, by looking at this post http://nissandiesel.dyndns.org/viewtopic.php?p=7735.

The wax pellet according to this

http://nissandiesel.dyndns.org/viewtopic.php?p=18377#p18377

is thermowax, a pellet of wax in a component of the IP - the cold start device, that warms up as the engine does. When the engine is cold the wax is solid and makes a little hydraulic piston stick out advancing the idle, when the engine is warm the wax dissolves making the hydraulic piston decrease, reducing the idle. Please, anyone correct me if I have understood/explained it incorrectly.

So I have connected fuel and IP back up..... now having electrical problems, no start no crank.... I will take photos and draw a diagram to post here. Its a challenge as this vehicle has had three different engines, wiring is as original as you can imagine, there are still remnants of petrol and LPG starter system. PLUS the fact Im learning as I go.....


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Post Number:#9  PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2014 5:23 am 
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Location: New Zealand
When I pulled the IP out a few wires became muddled and now it doesn't crank. This is a CF Bedford with a LD28 from a Laurel (C32). Its had its original petrol engine and the current diesel, its also run off LPG in the past. The diesel starter circuit has had a manual glow switch installed. Currently the system has a glow plug controller, a glow plug timer, a glow push button, and two relays (this is my current labelling of these parts, photos to follow.

Due to frustration with the sea of wires that seem to not go anywhere and are getting in the way of me trying to figure out the problem, I have ripped a few more out. So likely I have a system where I now need to add some connections.

Here is a diagram of the system I currently have. I need to figure out what I need to add to this system to get it to work again!

Image

On the fuel cut solenoid there are two wires, I only drew one by mistake, not sure where the other one goes to. There is also a oil sender unit (two wires) that maybe should be in this system too (I missed this off the diagram). And in the diagram #4 is I think a glow plug timer not a starter relay.

Here are some real life pictures..

The glow plug timer? The orange on left goes nowhere
Image

Two relay? (the white wire on left relay goes to the IP fuel cut solenoid)
Image

The glow plug controller with the manual push button wires wired into it
Image

From other diagrams I think this system should have a fusible link in it, unless I have misidentified things, I don't think this system currently has one...

So can any autospark geniuses out there help me out?

Thankyou for any help :)


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Post Number:#10  PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:55 pm 
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Location: Peyton Colorado
Still have to look at a pump for some questions, but as far as "it doesn't crank", there are only 3 wires that will run the starter motor. Battery ground to engine, battery Positive to starter solonoid, and one wire to ignition switch that supply's a postive current to the starter solonoid. The ignition switch wire can be substituted by a wire from the positive battery terminal to the starter solonoid connection, and the starter will crank. A no crank with all this correct could be a bad battery, starter, or seized engine. As far as the "Cold Start Device", I would imagine that if it's a warm day, 60-80 degrees F, the engine would start regardless, even with the Cold Start Device not working. The glow plugs need to work even on a warm day to properly start.

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Post Number:#11  PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 1:22 pm 
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Location: New Zealand
I've tested the starter and it works, once I can figure out the wiring life will be wonderful again. I could do with, wiring info ... from ignition, alternator, oil sender unit, starter relay, glow plug relay x 2, glow controller, and manual push button, fuel shut off solenoid. Anyone who can help me out if they wanted can have photos of a chick doing mechanics covered in engine oil, if that floats your boat.


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Post Number:#12  PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2014 5:31 pm 
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A'hem.. you feedback is spotty. Does it crank now? So this was a gasoline car, right? If so, make sure you have the Glow Plug circuit working and IP timing set correctly. I converted my gasoline Astro to LD28 power too. Most electrical wiring was there. For example, ignition ON (B+ to ECU) goes to IP RUN solenoid and Glow Plug Timer. All the info, schematics etc. you'll find on this forum. Just search. For now, you need only starter, glow plug circuit and oil pressure indicator to work. Once the engine runs, you can do the rest. Next you'll have to purge all the air out of the IP and fuel lines.
Have a spare battery on hand or better, connect two parallel with jumper cables. Procedure:
1) pump fuel with the manual fuel pump on top of the fuel filter (`1-2 min.) make sure there is diesel fuel in the tank
2) remove all glow plugs. While doing that, test them for continuity. Insulate supply wire, so it doesn't short out.
3) loosen all 6 injection supply lines (nuts) at the injectors
4) floor the gas pedal and crank the engine until fuel runs out of the loose injection lines. It can take 1-3 minutes cranckig until fuel will squirt out of the lines. If fuel does not come out, check if you run/stop solenoid is energized. Otherwise your IP is bad. :cry:
5) tighten all fuel line nuts, re-install and reconnect glow plugs.
6) start engine. The engine will not run at the first try. Crank engine for 15-20 sec. Make a pause and try again, each time activating the glow circuit. Engine should start shortly.
And yes, we want those pictures of you. :D Post them here.

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Astro Van with LD28 propulsion
'84 Mercedes 190D 2.2L 5-Speed Manual purchased 06/12 SOLD 06/13
'86 Ford Escort Wagon Diesel MT Sold 07-17-08


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