Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

Dealing with all subsystems specific to the diesel powered Datsun-Nissan 720 pickup trucks.

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JETTO
Posts: 6
Joined: 5 years ago

Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#1

Post by JETTO » 5 years ago

Hi I need help.

Vehicle type : Nissan 720 pick up LHD model
Year sold in our country : 1989 Philippines

Engine Nissan Diesel SD 23 with 5 speed manual transmission

Yesterday the 720 started fine as it normally did everyday. drove it out then came back home parked it in my garage.

This morning switching "on" the ignition:

looking at the dashboard

glow plug indicator no light
battery indicator no light
oil pressure lamp no light
Fuel gauge : Didnt move up


ok, then I started the engine ...It starts,,, runs normal, rev it a little then after about 10 seconds it turns off.

so i checked the fuse :
Ignition fuse 10 A Engine control :ok
Fuel ump QGS 15 A : ok
Meter 15 A : ok

made a visual check on the fuses and used a light tester to see if current is flowing to the fuse.

Fuel is full tank.

then trying to switch on and off.... suddenly the glow indicator lamp lits up so i started the engine it ran....for more than a minute but i noticed that the glow plug indicator didnt go off, so i turned off the engine.

then attempted to start it again. again indicator lights on the gauges dont lit. then started the engine again, it starts and runs and after 10 seconds turns itself off.

I noticed that after 10 seconds the mechanism of the injection pump moves as if cutting fuel supply.

I also noticed a relay ( black ) with 4 wires...it has 2 white wires and 2 small wires with a blue socket turns hot.

QGS type II making sounds. clicking clachank sound.

Battery is strong.... easily turns the engine.

I dont know what to do.

please help

waynosworld
Posts: 505
Joined: 7 years ago
Location: Vancouver Washington USA

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#2

Post by waynosworld » 5 years ago

Check your fusible links, the black and green wires connected to the battery in this photo, also check the connection to the battery itself.
Image
Sorry Al, I was told the attachment level had been met, so this was the only way to post a photo.
I know the voices are not real,
but they have some really good ideas.

JETTO
Posts: 6
Joined: 5 years ago

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#3

Post by JETTO » 5 years ago

yes , i checked for current, there's power from the sockets after the fusible links. i also checked the fusebox, all fuses have current

plenzen
Posts: 867
Joined: 12 years ago
Location: Cochrane Alberta Canada

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#4

Post by plenzen » 5 years ago

Remove and clean ALL grounds with a wire brush.
Not only the main battery ground but also any ground straps from the body to the frame etc.

Take those plugs apart that wayne took a photo of and check for corrosion inside.

It's a bad connection someplace
Retired Pauly
Problem with being retired is that you never get a day off.
1987 D21-J SD25 KC
KJLGD21FN

ehtrain
Posts: 141
Joined: 8 years ago
Location: regina, sk

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#5

Post by ehtrain » 5 years ago

i have had some of the glow plug relays go bad on me. Just age I'd assume. I know my glow plugs would do weird things on my td27t when relay would start messing up.

Id agree with earlier statements tho. check your connections first

JETTO
Posts: 6
Joined: 5 years ago

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#6

Post by JETTO » 5 years ago

update:

headlights, hazzard lights , horn, tail lights, clock working, signal lights working


still no lights on the glow plug indicators, battery, hand brake, oil idiot lights


tested the fuse box has power on the fuses....there's power
i tested the fusible links... i attached a light tester to see if there's current after the sockets.... there's power.


Image

Image


Image






what for is this relay attached with the fusebox? Is this for the ignition control and panel gauge idiot lights?

part number is 25230- C9990
MB5A 011

It has 5 terminals.......left side 2, top 2, rightside 1.


Image


Image




Still.... not running :(



























http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=mwtnah&s=8#.VCt6jGfa46Y
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=33cb5lg ... Ct6_2fa46Y
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2r5g6wx ... Ct9H2fa46Y
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=214w9pe ... Ct9m2fa46Y
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=288pffo ... Ct-FGfa46Y

waynosworld
Posts: 505
Joined: 7 years ago
Location: Vancouver Washington USA

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#7

Post by waynosworld » 5 years ago

You only have one relay which is strange, in the USA we have 2 relays, one for the headlights, and the other for the heater motor, but your country may have different standards for wiring harnesses.
You should get some help to test the glow plug power, turn the key on, and then check the rear glow plug itself for power till you hear a click, then the glow plug power should terminate, if you do not have power to the glow plugs themselves when you first turn on the key, then you have an issue, the glow plug power goes threw a relay before it gets to the glow plugs, or maybe something got unplugged, test for power at the glow plugs themselves.
Another thing you need to look at after confirming you have glow plug power is the injection pump controller, as you have the inline injection pump, have your helper turn the key on and let the glow plugs warm up, when you hear the click or the glow plug light goes out, have your helper try and start it and watch the injection pump controller arm, if it doesn't move right after the starter engages, then you have an issue with one of the many electronic components controlling the engine, when this happens I disconnect that arm from the injection pump and then I start the engine to be sure that is the reason it was not starting, if it starts let it run for a little while to make sure it does keep running, then shut it down by twisting the IP control shaft counter clockwise and then start unplugging and plugging back in all the plugs having to do with the engine control systems and re-connect the arm to the IP, if that doesn't get it working again, then one of the components may be bad such as the IP controller, or the DPC module.
Let us know what happens, if it helps or not.
I know the voices are not real,
but they have some really good ideas.

JETTO
Posts: 6
Joined: 5 years ago

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#8

Post by JETTO » 5 years ago

I see the other black relay is also located at the engine bay....i think its for the glow plugs its beside an electronic module ( black square shape) with round sockets located near the right fender.

when i switch the key to "on" position ..... i put my test lights on the glow plug...there's power

but no click sound to cut off power.

after 5 seconds in "on" position.... i start the engine... there is no current in the glow plugs.

But the engine runs for about 10 seconds then dies.

waynosworld
Posts: 505
Joined: 7 years ago
Location: Vancouver Washington USA

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#9

Post by waynosworld » 5 years ago

As I said in my last post, you need to watch that control arm connected to the injection pump, when it shuts down after 10 seconds, is the the arm pulling down on the injection pump control arm and cutting the fuel off, or does the engine shut down without that arm even moving, you need to watch it while someone else is operating the key.
This question above is important, it helps me figure out what is going on.
The black box next to the glow plug relay in the engine compartment is the DPC module, the glow plug timer is located in the cab on the right kick panel just under/beside the glove compartment.
You need to watch what the injection pump control arm is doing from starting it to when it shuts down, as I said in the post above, the arm should move to the start position just after the starter engages the flywheel, then after it starts it should move to the run position which is another 1/4 turn on the IP controller which is below the injection pump, after it is running the arm should not move till you turn off the key, if it moves without turning off the key, then something is wrong with the engine control system, and if you want to drive it, your going to have to remove the arm from the IP controller to the IP arm itself till you/we figure out what is wrong.
This is the IP arm you need to watch.
Image
This is the injection pump controller, the arm goes to the injection pump control arm.
Image
This is the glow plug timer in the cab.
Image
Image
This is the DPC module on the right side inner fender well with the glow plug relay next to it.
Image


JETTO wrote:I see the other black relay is also located at the engine bay....i think its for the glow plugs its beside an electronic module ( black square shape) with round sockets located near the right fender.

when i switch the key to "on" position ..... i put my test lights on the glow plug...there's power

but no click sound to cut off power.

after 5 seconds in "on" position.... i start the engine... there is no current in the glow plugs.

But the engine runs for about 10 seconds then dies.
I know the voices are not real,
but they have some really good ideas.

JETTO
Posts: 6
Joined: 5 years ago

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#10

Post by JETTO » 5 years ago

Yes. when I start the engine that arm on the injection pump moves, after about 10 seconds it moves to shut down the fuel.

Is the glow plug timer located near the right kick panel?

A friend recommends removing the fusible links, says that when the current flows the fusible links heat up and ressistance on the fusible links increase thereby having weak electrical flow. Since its old he recomends directly tapping the wires on the battery terminal.

waynosworld
Posts: 505
Joined: 7 years ago
Location: Vancouver Washington USA

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#11

Post by waynosworld » 5 years ago

I would not recommend removing the fusible links, they are there for a reason.
The fusible links are all for power, one white one goes to the glow relay, the other white one goes to the alternator/DPC module/fuse block, the white with the black line goes to the ignition switch, and the red wire goes to the light switch.
I would first suspect the fusible link/white wire that goes to the alt./DPC module/fuse block, if that wire doesn't have a full 12V, things might not work properly, it also controls the room lamp, cigarette lighter, stop lamp, and hazard flasher, horn relay, heater relay, and the clock if you have one, are you having issues with any of these things?

Something is wrong with the engine control system, Al knows more than I do about it than I do, maybe he will chime in here and tell you what is wrong with it if he knows, but it sounds like it's a power issue, or lack of power issue actually.
Maybe your DPC module has gone bad, I have never heard of the issue your having, but I also never heard of the problem I am having with mine either, which I cannot seem to fix, but I have not tried hard to fix it yet either, I do have an alternator issue right now.
A lot of guys put a choke cable on the IP control arm and pull it to shut down the engine, and when they want to start it, they push the choke cable in, it's very low tech, but it works, the DPC module is kinda hard to find, but they show up on ebay every once in a while.

The glow plug timer is on the right kick panel.
I know the voices are not real,
but they have some really good ideas.

JETTO
Posts: 6
Joined: 5 years ago

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#12

Post by JETTO » 5 years ago

DPC Module available here at Nissan Parts locally.... very expensive.

Cost around US $ 360.00 brand new.

Wirings were sorted out today from the fusebox to trace if there are any loose connections. seem like the power from the ignition switch to the fuse box comes and go.

Removed the electric tape which holds the harness to the fusebox.

I found that some of the wires connected in the OEM wire loom were not soldered.

After tinkering a bit and got a live wire from the ignition switch and bypass it directly to the fuse box, some of the indicators (battery, glow plug, handbrake) went on.


Fusible links were now eliminated.

wires are now directly connected to the battery terminal.

To eliminate the factor that corroded terminals are the culprit.


I bought an aerosol Electric Contact cleaner and sprayed the terminals of the fusebox.

Made a bypass wire from the Ignition(+) to the fusebox.

Now the gauge indicators are properly "ON" with the glow plug indicators, battery, oil, and handbrake lights working.

It seems that the terminals loose contacts as dirt and corrosion build up in the sockets.


I start it again...... Its RUNNING!

With a multi Tester.... the alternator charges the battery at 14 .3 volts at idle.

***by the way I already replaced the stock alternator with a 90 amp alternator from a Nissan Serena with a built in IC regulator a year ago. the OEM voltage regulator was already eliminated.



Its running ok now.

I drove it around the block twice , seems normal. I Turn off the engine and start it again.... I think its already fix.

I'll continue wrapping with wires with electric tape tomorrow.


Thank you everyone for sharing your advise and ideas.

More power to everyone! :)


I'll post pictures tomorrow

plenzen
Posts: 867
Joined: 12 years ago
Location: Cochrane Alberta Canada

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#13

Post by plenzen » 5 years ago

Glad you got it figured out
Retired Pauly
Problem with being retired is that you never get a day off.
1987 D21-J SD25 KC
KJLGD21FN

dn29626
Posts: 249
Joined: 10 years ago
Location: Anderson, SC

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#14

Post by dn29626 » 5 years ago

I am thinking there is an oil sensor on these trucks that shuts it off to protect the engine. I am wondering if that is the reason for the shut down.
I think Al is my source on that tid bit of info. PM Al Savage .
82 King Cab 2wd (nice)
82 Reg Cab (body damage)
Anderson , SC
Since Fall 2009

waynosworld
Posts: 505
Joined: 7 years ago
Location: Vancouver Washington USA

Re: Help needed starting my SD23 720 Pick up

#15

Post by waynosworld » 5 years ago

I am thinking it was a fusible link issue, but they have been deleted now, and it runs correctly again, be very careful now, you have no fusible links, if something shorts out like a wire hitting the glow plug ends or wires, you can have a fire now.
I know the voices are not real,
but they have some really good ideas.

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