Toro 826 38150 (1985)

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asavage
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Toro 826 38150 (1985)

#1

Post by asavage »

I picked up a snowblower. I don't know why. These things just happen sometimes. This model is from 1985, is two-stage, and features individual wheel jaw clutches, a friction disc ground speed control, and solid auger drums.

This is powered by a 8HP B&S 190402-272041, which has no electric starter nor charging coil, but has a toothed flywheel for an optional electric starter motor. Some models had electric starter upgrade kits available; I have to assume that the 120V (AC) starter kit was popular, so they furnished the toothed flywheel stock.

Modern snowblowers have various ways to quickly move the discharge chute left/right/forward etc., but this era used a crude worm gear setup that is hand-cranked to swivel the chute, and the crank is quite low, not very ergonomic, and if you're using a snowblower much you are constantly having to move where the blower moves the snow, so this hand-crank is a primary human-machine interface. People have moved the lever higher via cutting the shaft and inserting a u-joint etc, but you're still hand-cranking it. Here's how one person modified theirs:

[ref: https://www.snowblowerforum.com/threads ... st-1778653]
Toro 826 Chute Swivel hand-crank (original)
Toro 826 Chute Swivel hand-crank (original)
Toro_826_Chute_Swivel_01b.jpg (473.08 KiB) Viewed 1735 times
Toro 826 Chute Swivel hand-crank (modified via u-joint)
Toro 826 Chute Swivel hand-crank (modified via u-joint)
Toro_826_Chute_Swivel_02b.jpg (461.12 KiB) Viewed 1728 times

More modern approaches involve installing an electric motor and switchgear. Notes/ideas on doing something like this on mine follow.


The basic circuit:

[ref.: http://www.robmeyerproductions.com/bows.html]
Basic DC Motor Reversing Circuit with Relays and Limit Switches
Basic DC Motor Reversing Circuit with Relays and Limit Switches
Chute_Forward_Reverse_Circuit_01b.png (183.99 KiB) Viewed 1733 times


Modified circuit. Below, I've changed the above circuit slightly. The limit switches now ground the relays' coils, which eliminates one wire in the harness to the limit switches. And a Transient Voltage Suppressor is added (D1), because that motor is going to want to arc the relays' contacts without one.

Tweaked DC Motor Reversing Circuit with Relays, Limit Switches, and TVS.
Tweaked DC Motor Reversing Circuit with Relays, Limit Switches, and TVS.
Chute_Forward_Reverse_Circuit_04b.png (116.45 KiB) Viewed 1628 times


Gearmotor: Car seat motor (surplus, new), Amazon B005IR1NBA, $38, around 190 RPM with ~7/16" shaft that's actually a linear actuator shaft. About 1.5A with minimal load. Others have successfully used this gearmotor for powering their chute swivels on Honda HS928 etc.
[ref. https://www.snowblowerforum.com/threads ... els.80393/]
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA
Gearmotor_B005IR1NBA_01b.jpg (57.46 KiB) Viewed 1715 times
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA
Gearmotor_B005IR1NBA_02b.jpg (76.33 KiB) Viewed 1714 times
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA
Gearmotor_B005IR1NBA_03b.jpg (95.11 KiB) Viewed 1714 times
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA
Gearmotor_B005IR1NBA_04b.jpg (51.44 KiB) Viewed 1714 times
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA, installed on a Honda HS928
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA, installed on a Honda HS928
Gearmotor_B005IR1NBA_05b.jpg (124.59 KiB) Viewed 1714 times
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA, connector view.
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA, connector view.
Gearmotor_B005IR1NBA_08b.jpg (478.91 KiB) Viewed 1625 times
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA, connector view.
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA, connector view.
Gearmotor_B005IR1NBA_06b.jpg (382.5 KiB) Viewed 1625 times
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA, connector view.
Gearmotor B005IR1NBA, connector view.
Gearmotor_B005IR1NBA_07b.jpg (316.46 KiB) Viewed 1625 times


Connector/Pigtail for Gearmotor: AC Delco PT3156 (replaces PT159), $17. The gearmotor has 3/16" wide flat male quick-connector terminals. I assume one could obtain mating 3/16" female spade terminals, but I wanted better mechanical rigidity.
Connector/Pigtail, AC Delco PT3156 (replaces PT159).
Connector/Pigtail, AC Delco PT3156 (replaces PT159).
Connector_Pigtail_ACDelco_PT3156_01b .jpg (33.54 KiB) Viewed 1626 times


[later]
The connector can be purchased ala carte.
Packard->Delphi->Aptiv 12064749 mating connector is a Metri-Pack 480 Series (unsealed).

Housings:
Amazon (pack of (10)), $12 (shipped)
eBay (lot of (10)), $8 (shipped)
Mouser 829-12064749, $0.72 ea. (plus shipping)

Terminals:
The terminals come in a variety of wire sizes; one of the part Nos. (for 12-14 AWG) is Aptiv 12065892-L, Mouser 829-12065892 , $0.35 ea. ((2) req'd.)

Connector Housing, Aptiv 12064749.  Male housing for female terminals.  Unsealed.
Connector Housing, Aptiv 12064749. Male housing for female terminals. Unsealed.
Connector_Aptiv_12064749 _01b.png (558.57 KiB) Viewed 1596 times
Connector Housing, Aptiv 12064749.  Male housing for female terminals.  Unsealed.
Connector Housing, Aptiv 12064749. Male housing for female terminals. Unsealed.
Connector_Aptiv_12064749 _02b.png (580.5 KiB) Viewed 1596 times
Connector Terminal, Aptiv 12065892.  Female terminal, 4.8mm (3/16") wide, 12-14 AWG.  Unsealed.
Connector Terminal, Aptiv 12065892. Female terminal, 4.8mm (3/16") wide, 12-14 AWG. Unsealed.
Terminal_Aptive_12065892_01b.png (87.46 KiB) Viewed 1596 times
Connector Housing, Aptiv 12064749 & Terminal 12065892 .
Connector Housing, Aptiv 12064749 & Terminal 12065892 .
Connector_Aptiv_12064749 _05b.png (3.61 MiB) Viewed 1581 times

Switch, DPDT Momentary: K4 13-211ST "Triple Sealed" DPDT (ON)-OFF-(ON), 20A, screw terminals. While I don't need DPDT (SPDT would be fine), this is what I could order in a reasonable timeframe at a reasonable price.
Switch, "Triple Sealed" DPDT (ON)-OFF-(ON), 20A, screw terminals.  Front/side view.
Switch, "Triple Sealed" DPDT (ON)-OFF-(ON), 20A, screw terminals. Front/side view.
Switch_K4_13-211ST-Sealed-Switch-DPDT-12v-MON-OFF-MON-20A-Screw-Terminals_01b.jpg (39.41 KiB) Viewed 1642 times
Switch, "Triple Sealed" DPDT (ON)-OFF-(ON), 20A, screw terminals.  Terminals view.
Switch, "Triple Sealed" DPDT (ON)-OFF-(ON), 20A, screw terminals. Terminals view.
Switch_K4_13-211ST-Sealed-Switch-DPDT-12v-MON-OFF-MON-20A-Screw-Terminals_02b.jpg (41.85 KiB) Viewed 1642 times
Bling for this switch: K4 Switch_Cover, K4_19-531. Switch lever cover for 04-1300 Series switches, hot green. Their stock photo looks kinda dirty, eh?
Switch lever cover for 04-1300 Series switches, hot green.  K4 19-531
Switch lever cover for 04-1300 Series switches, hot green. K4 19-531
Switch_Cover_K4_19-531_Switch_lever_cover_for_04-1300_Series_switches_hot_green_01b.jpg (11.65 KiB) Viewed 1641 times
Switch, "Triple Sealed" DPDT (ON)-OFF-(ON), 20A, screw terminals, and weather cover.  Packaging view.
Switch, "Triple Sealed" DPDT (ON)-OFF-(ON), 20A, screw terminals, and weather cover. Packaging view.
Switch_K4_13-211ST-Sealed-Switch-DPDT-12v-MON-OFF-MON-20A-Screw-Terminals_03b.jpg (1.51 MiB) Viewed 1598 times



Limit switches: (reed switches), Littelfuse 59140-4-S-02-A. These are NC reed switches that open when a magnet gets near a target zone on the switch. They sell their own magnet separately, but I am thinking I'll epoxy generic magnets to the swiveling chute. One switch & magnet pair for each direction's endpoint.

59140-4-S-02-A breakdown
  • 59140 =Switch Series
  • 4 = Type = SPST, NC
  • S = Sensitivity = .457" (using 57140 actuator). This is the most sensitive of the four options, with the least sensitive being about .248" range.
  • 02 = Leads (wires) length = 11-3/4"
  • A = Tinned leads
Reed Switch, Littelfuse 59140-4-S-02-A
Reed Switch, Littelfuse 59140-4-S-02-A
Reed_Switch_Littelfuse_59140-4-S-02-A _01b.png (20.32 KiB) Viewed 1725 times


Relays:: Panasonic ACT512. This is an especially nice find, as it's TWO Form C relays in a single package. Two identical, discrete relays in a single module. Solder lugs, though. Datasheet
Panasonic ACT512 Relay pkg., Form C x2, top view 2
Panasonic ACT512 Relay pkg., Form C x2, top view 2
Relay_Dual_Form_C_Panasonic_ACT501_02b.png (84.07 KiB) Viewed 1724 times
Panasonic ACT512 Relay pkg., Form C x2, top view 1
Panasonic ACT512 Relay pkg., Form C x2, top view 1
Relay_Dual_Form_C_Panasonic_ACT501_03b.png (559.85 KiB) Viewed 1724 times
Panasonic ACT512 Relay pkg., Form C x2, bottom view
Panasonic ACT512 Relay pkg., Form C x2, bottom view
Relay_Dual_Form_C_Panasonic_ACT501_04b.png (614.08 KiB) Viewed 1718 times
Panasonic ACT512 Relay pkg., Form C x2, datasheet markup
Panasonic ACT512 Relay pkg., Form C x2, datasheet markup
Relay_Dual_Form_C_Panasonic_ACT501_01b.png (782.83 KiB) Viewed 1724 times

These ACT512 relays are tiny.
Panasonic ACT512 Relay pkg., Form C x2, "hand" view
Panasonic ACT512 Relay pkg., Form C x2, "hand" view
Relay_Dual_Form_C_Panasonic_ACT501_05b.jpg (600.62 KiB) Viewed 1671 times


Transient Voltage Suppressor: LiittleFuse P6KE16CA TVS DIODE, 600W, 16V, DO-15 (10 pieces). This is a bidirectional zener diode (pair of zeners) in a single package. It damps the inductive voltage spike of the motor when the relays open, which in turn should extend the relays' contact life significantly. Good circuit design practice for mechanically switched DC inductive loads.
[ref. https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/318013/snubber-diodes-for-a-dc-motor-with-2-relays/318078#318078 , Fig. 3]

Transient Voltage Suppressor, LiittleFuse P6KE16CA TVS DIODE, 600W, 16V, DO-15
Transient Voltage Suppressor, LiittleFuse P6KE16CA TVS DIODE, 600W, 16V, DO-15
Transient_Voltage_Suppressor_LiittleFuse_P6KE16CA_TVS_DIODE_600W_16V_ DO-15_01b.png (13.73 KiB) Viewed 1635 times


Connectors.
Molex Connector Lot (5), (2-circuit), 14-20 AWG, .093” w/lock
Molex Connector Lot (5), (2-circuit), 14-20 AWG, .093" w/lock
Molex Connector Lot (5), (2-circuit), 14-20 AWG, .093" w/lock
Molex Connector Lot (5), (2-circuit), 14-20 AWG, .093 with lock.jpg (86.45 KiB) Viewed 1666 times

Molex Connector Lot (3), (3-circuit), 14-20 AWG, .093" w/lock
Molex Connector Lot (3), (3-circuit), 14-20 AWG, .093" w/lock
Molex Connector Lot (3), (3-circuit), 14-20 AWG, .093" w/lock
Molex Connector Lot (3), (3-circuit), 14-20 AWG, .093 with lock.jpg (119.82 KiB) Viewed 1666 times
Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.
plenzen
Posts: 890
Joined: 16 years ago
Location: Cochrane Alberta Canada

Re: Toro 826 38150 (1985)

#2

Post by plenzen »

You've gone this far, might as well get a remote control, or better yet, rip the guts and brains out of a Roomba and let it run and learn by itself. :D :D

You have a "project".
Retired Pauly
Problem with being retired is that you never get a day off.
1987 D21-J SD25 KC
KJLGD21FN
User avatar
asavage
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Posts: 5431
Joined: 18 years ago
Location: Oak Harbor, Wash.
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Re: Toro 826 38150 (1985)

#3

Post by asavage »

I don’t think I need to swivel the chute position when I’m not standing at the controls, but it’ll be very easy to implement.

Oh, you mean to be able to sit in the livingroom and have it run around the neighborhood? Not this beast, it’s a long way from being able to be fully automated. There are just more controls than you have on a more modern machine.
  • Manual choke lever (not on the control panel)
  • Primer (1986-on?) on engine
  • Key ON/OFF
  • Throttle -- Slow<->Fast, plus OFF (ignition grounding)
  • Auger belt control
  • Chute discharge direction crank
  • Chute discharge loft (not on the control panel)
  • Traction speed (R-1-2-3)
  • Wheel Clutches: Left & Right side
  • Electric starter cord & button (if equipped; for the 120v version, the start button is on the engine, not the control panel)
  • Finally, the safety (deadman) levers under the handgrips.
Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.
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