Jet Equipment "Jet-16 Drilling & Milling Machine&qu

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Jet Equipment "Jet-16 Drilling & Milling Machine&qu

#1

Post by asavage » 13 years ago

I have been fabricating (or, rather, being the General Contractor for the various bits) a portability frame for a mid-sized genset for my father. During construction, I've found the limitations of our two chinese drill presses to be too great to maintain the geometry of the holes I want to punch. The quill of the $39 Central Machinery (Harbor Freight) 8" press has about .070" slop in it, and the Rockwell radial drill has almost that much. Both are benchtop units, and they are OK as far as they go, but I tried to drill a straight 1/4" hole through the top and bottom of a 2" square tube, and had 1/8" variance in location! Ouch.

Another problem is that neither of those two drill presses can turn the chuck at less than 600 RPM, which makes it impossible to drill a hole larger than about 1/2" (I've fudged and drilled 5/8", but it's very easy to smoke a bit at that feet/minute). I want something with an intermediate sheave to allow for slower speeds than what is possible with a two-sheave belt drive.

So I've been scouting eBay (local) and CL for a better drill press. What's available is primarily Crafstman (of various vintages), Delta, and antiques. That's pretty much all that's become available this summer. I was looking for something a step up from Craftsman.

What I ran across sorta by accident three weeks ago was a Jet Equipment of Tacoma (ie Taiwan) "Jet-16 Drilling & Milling Machine".

Image

The motor is dated 1978, so it's coming up on 30 yrs old.

I had no idea what a "Drilling & Milling Machine" might be, but it looked like a big enough drill press anyway. Unfortunately, it was in Monroe, which in the scheme of Puget Sound is a loooong way away, but I eventually got there, bought it the same day the CL ad appeared. Had to use the seller's pallet jack and my portable engine hoist to get it out of his garage and into this trailer that by now you are probably all sick of seeing:

Image Image

It came with a nice, sturdy metal stand to which it bolts, and it's even almost level. Belt cover missing, and grimy but the quill is very tight, so I bought it anyway. Wired for 240v (7a). The stand is about 150 lbs, the Jet-16 is probably near 450 or 500 lbs. Heavier than it looks, anyway: I can't lift one side at all.

I gave $300 for it. Hauled it 150 miles back to the shop, cleared a space for it, used the gantry hoist to get part A on top of part B again.

Image

First thing that has to go is that ON/OFF switch. Remember: 240v. How many things can you see wrong in this picture?

Image

No ground :roll:. And switching one side only of a 240v circuit (ie the light switch) is very dangerous: it leaves all the wiring in the machine live. I installed a DPST switch to cure all that:

Image

Then I had to run a 240v extension cord for it, which required buying new connector ends too, as it was all shot from age.

Spent pretty much an entire Sunday, five cans of WD40, two cans of carb cleaner, two cans of Tri-Flow, and a lot of rags to clean it all up:

Image Image Image


The Jet-16 is not listed on Jet Equipment's website, but an inquiry to their Sales dept got me a PDF via email. Not a very good one, but it does have a parts breakdown and some basic setup/operating instructions, including the priceless belt guide chart.


Image

The PDF was made from a fax, and was poor quality. I invested several hours with PhotoShop and cleaned it up considerably, including dropping new text into that chart. I've printed it out and will have it laminated tomorrow, to hang by the machine.

The tables are a bit tight but operate OK if you have a strong arm. One handwheel is missing ($30 from Jet) and another is cracked and epoxied, so those will have to be replaced.

I've determined that the spindle is set up for Bridgeport R8 (yea!). I have the one Jacobs chuck adapter, which is fine for drilling. I spent much of today manhandling the portability frame all around it, and got four 3/4" holes just the way I wanted them: slow, and straight. Yessss!

I am not a machinist, have almost no training in this. I think I need an end mill like this, only with an R8 shank:
www.anconline.com-Images-Endmilling.JPG
www.anconline.com-Images-Endmilling.JPG (62.85KiB)Viewed 336 times
I think I want the replaceable carbide tips. Looks like another couple hundred to buy a three-piece set (1-1/4", 1-1/2", 2"). I need 2" so I can remove .020" on all four sides of the portability frame's caster outriggers, to get a little more clearance where they slide in. Even without paint, they're quite tight.

I am real new to this game. Anybody have tips on tooling that is a "must have"? I have one vise for the X-axis table, and two working T-slot anchors. I know I'll need more hold-down stuff. What else?
Last edited by asavage 13 years ago, edited 4 times in total.
Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.

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#2

Post by asavage » 13 years ago

I am missing one plastic handwheel (on the right) -- actually, the hub remains . . .

Image

. . . and the forward one has been epoxied. Jet (WMH Tool Group) has obsoleted all parts for this antique, so I just ordered two generic "cast metal" wheels from Grizzly ($9 ea.)
Image
[dead link 2020: it looks similar to today's Grizzly H3190:]
Grizzly_H3190_Cast-Iron-Handwheel-8-inch.jpg
Grizzly H3190 - Cast Iron Handwheel - 8"
Grizzly_H3190_Cast-Iron-Handwheel-8-inch.jpg (31.16KiB)Viewed 336 times
and I'll have to bore & ream them to 3/4", then cut the three-lobe jaws on the backside to interface with the table dials. I will actually be using the Jet-16 to make parts for itself :)

The 3/4" bore does not seem to be available for a 6-1/4" wheel from anyone, and neither is the jaw setup, so I'm pretty much stuck with having to fabricate it.

I did get the spindle speed/belt chart laminated and next to the rig.

I put the Operator's Manual for the JET 16 online, after making all the pages a lot more legible than I received it.

I ordered a fly cutter from Grizzly
Grizzly_G2861-Face-Mill.jpg
Grizzly G2861 - Face Mill
Grizzly_G2861-Face-Mill.jpg (45.28KiB)Viewed 336 times
along with some carbide cutters
Grizzly_G4051-Carbide-Insert.jpg
Grizzly G4051 - Carbide Insert
Grizzly_G4051-Carbide-Insert.jpg (72.55KiB)Viewed 336 times
and some holding fixtures/clamps
Grizzly_G1076-58-pc.-Clamping-Kit-for-5-8-inch-T-Slots.jpg
Grizzly G1076 - 58-pc. Clamping Kit for 5/8" T-Slots
Grizzly_G1076-58-pc.-Clamping-Kit-for-5-8-inch-T-Slots.jpg (83.96KiB)Viewed 336 times

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#3

Post by davehoos » 13 years ago

in australia it a requirement that a saftey switch be used.normally a kick switch or a pedal.

probably not an electrical requirement but a workcover or O H and S deal.
so a house holder may not worry about it also an earth leakage circuit are common requirement for all residents and workshops.

had me looking as you used the 240V term.
some of the 200V [asian]stuff i see is dodgey.
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#4

Post by asavage » 13 years ago

Got the flycutter today -- it looks a lot better in my hand than that picture would suggest -- as well as the clamps set. As I suspected, the t-slots are too wide for my table. First order of business: use the flycutter to narrow the t-slots to fit! Took four passes, works a charm. Nobody told me how much fun this would be :)
Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.

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#5

Post by TooManyIdeas » 13 years ago

The pulley you are looking for (this and MSCDIRECT.com are wonderful sites)
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?U ... powerTrans
6.25-OD-3-4-Bore-1-Groove-Pulley-1-BK65-C.jpg
6.25 OD 3/4 Bore 1 Groove Pulley
item number: 1-BK65-C
6.25-OD-3-4-Bore-1-Groove-Pulley-1-BK65-C.jpg (231.67KiB)Viewed 330 times
If I could give a word of advice in your new found machining pleasures.

1) Do not under any circumstance use a Jacobs chuck for machining. The are designed for drilling/reaming operations only. If you try to machine across the x or y axis with one, it will have a tendency to come flying out at the most inconvenient times. But then again who needs all those extra fingers, and one does have two eyes. :lol:

2) If you are looking for a fairly precise hole might I recommend finish reaming. Drill bits are very good at making relatively close tolerance holes. However they pretty much suck if you want a perfectly round hole. Drill to about .015" shy of the finish diameter and ream to finsh size. Slow down the rpm's to about 1/2 to 3/4 drilling speed and always use plenty of lube. Also after the reamer has finished cutting through the hole, do raise the reamer out of the hole while it is still on. If you raise the quill with the reamer stopped, you can damage the reamer and score your new hole.

3) High speeds low feeds yeild the best finishes but again lube lube lube

4) Don't worry about getting indexable cutters with the r8 shanks. Unless you plan on taking very heavy or very large surface cuts, a standard high speed steel endmill inside a r8 shank collet will work more than fine. Also just an FYI, if you get a traditional centercutting endmill you can plunge cut, allowing counterbore, spotfaces, or large very accurate holes. And a good rule of thumb, 2 flutes for aluminum, 4 flutes for steel.

Just a funny observation as well, I don't know why Grizzly calls that a fly cutter. Every place I've seen calls that and indexable facing mill.

A Fly cutter from what I'm used to is a slightly angled pate at the end of a shank with a slot in it for a HSS tool blank which can be telescoped in or out depending on the diameter of cut needed. They are a bit more low tech and slightly dangerous (when cutter spins it invisible and to heavy a cut will launch the tool blank) but they are also the most versatile and leave a very cool rainbow finish.
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#6

Post by asavage » 13 years ago

TooManyIdeas wrote:The pulley you are looking for (this and MSCDIRECT.com are wonderful sites)
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?U ... powerTrans
That is a very good idea, to add a handle to that and voila! It becomes a handwheel. Better than the alternatives.

I received the two Grizzly handwheels today, and the hubs are a lot shallower and smaller than I expected, making them not as useful, because I can't cut the jaws out of them. The picture for the part above looks like there is a lot more meat to cut the three jaws from. Excellent find, Thanks!

If I could give a word of advice in your new found machining plesures.

1) Do not under any circumstance use a jacobs chuck for machining.
While my boss had already related how he tried to mill using the Jacobs chuck and had his come apart in just the manner you describe, I do not mind hearing that twice.
If you are looking for a fairly precise hole might I recomend finsh reaming.
I've been eyeing bore heads. Seems like (if the hole is not too deep) a nice way to get a round hole. They are not especially expensive either, unlike a set of finish reamers. Although the adjustable reamer look interesting -- I've used them for finish reaming kingpin bushings in the past, but always someone else's reamer. Your thoughts?
3) High speeds low feeds yeild the best finishes but again lube lube lube
Talk to me of carbide & lube.
Don't worry about getting indexable cutters with the r8 shanks. Unless you plan on taking very heavy or very large surface cuts, a standard high speed steel endmill inside a r8 shank collet will work more than fine.
OK.
And a good rule of thumb, 2 flutes for aluminum, 4 flutes for steel.
Just one more of those things one can't easily pick up without working with someone who has learned this the traditional way.

I am playing with this machine more or less in a vacuum, which is scary.
Just a funny obsevation as well, I don't know why Grizzly calls that a fly cutter. Every place I've seen calls that and indexable facing mill.
Their catalog calls it a face mill. The packing slip & invoice have "fly cutter" which I now know is the wrong description.

I do not know what "indexable" means in the context of an end mill, but it seems to me its major advantage over a std end mill is that I can change the cutters out rather cheaply, rather than having to have the end mill resharpened. Do I have that wrong?
Last edited by asavage 13 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.

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#7

Post by TooManyIdeas » 13 years ago

Indexable is a term given to an arbour that utilizes replaceable cutters. The common type is the triangle cutters that can be rotated 3 times before having to be replaced. It is very cheap and convienent to have repalcable cutters but...

A word of caution when it comes to carbide. Carbide likes continuos cuts on very hard surfaces. If you try and machine an interupted cut, (irregular surface where a smooth finish can't be achived with one pass) You will get very frustrated braking cutters. I find too that aluminum machines better with HSS than carbide.

For what its worth, if you take care of a traditional cutter, and maintain the proper speeds and feeds, it will take a long time to dull an endmill. But on the other hand, since you are learning broken, chipped, and cooked cutters are inevitable. I've been doing this for the better part of 10 years and I still mess up a cutter every once and a while.

I'll tell you this too. Boring heads are a pain in the ass. On a normal milling machine boring is acomplished with a powerfeed attachment on the quill. It is extrodinarally hard to keep tolerances and get a good surface finish with a proper mill. I'm betting damn near impossible on a mill/drill. But if you have the paitence for it and are not concerned with surface finish or holding a tolerence of less than .005" they could work for you. However, since you'd have to hand feed it take extremely light cuts (about .020" max) or it WILL grab and bad thing will happen. ANd again just like reaming, don't stop the cutter until you pull back out of the hole.

Adjustable reamers are garbage as well. they dull quickly and get thrown out of adjustment if you look at them funny. We HAD a set at my shop everyone used them ONCE.

Another vitally important tool to have is a good set of micrometers. Calipers are good for close enough but if you want dead nuts go get a good mityutoyo, starret, or Browne&sharp. Harbor Freight has nothing to offer in this regard. MSCDIRECT.com.
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#8

Post by asavage » 13 years ago

TooManyIdeas wrote:A word of caution when it comes to carbide. Carbide likes continuos cuts on very hard surfaces.
I assume that light cuts can help avoid that. My (first) face mill is fairly large at 2", so for the job I'm doing now, it does overlap the work (~1.5") and while I'm hearing the characteristic rythmic knocking noise, while taking ~.012" cut I wasn't shaking the table with the load ;) This is steel.
I find too that aluminum machines better with HSS than carbide.
Hmmmm.
I'll tell you this too. Boring heads are a pain in the ass. . . . and are not concerned with surface finish or holding a tolerence of less than .005" they could work for you. However, since you'd have to hand feed it take extremely light cuts (about .020" max) . . .
Hmmm. .005" is pretty loose to work with. Since I do not know right now how I will be using this rig, I don't know if a boring head will be adequate. Given the budget, I would rather have a set of reamers but the damned things are expensive when you want a selection of sizes -- which is why the boring heads are touted as an alternative for making reasonable-tolerance holes.

I hadn't thought about the lack of powerfeed WRT use of a boring head.
Adjustable reamers are garbage as well.
Thanks for letting me know. That's pretty much what I thought.
Another vitally important tool to have is a good set of micrometers. Calipers are good for close enough but if you want dead nuts go get a good mityutoyo, starret, or Browne&sharp. Harbor Freight has nothing to offer in this regard. MSCDIRECT.com.
My mics were stolen years ago and I never replaced them (didn't need them anymore anyway). I have a quite good Central dial cap that I bought in 1977 and have kept in good condition -- AIR it cost me a hard-earned $60 at the time, and only name "Central" is comparable to the crap HF sells with the same name.

I think I picked up a Mitu dial cap from eBay for my service van last month (I bought several to spread around our shop). For locksmithing, a dial cap is plenty.

If I pick up a mic, I'll want telescoping (bore) gauges too. But later . . . I have to pay down some debt for a few months now, I've over-spent this summer.
Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.

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#9

Post by asavage » 13 years ago

So much for paying-down debt, I'm in it up to my eyeballs now . . .

I've got a telescoping gauge set (had to have it for the Saginaw-into-Ford PS pump project), outside mics, DTI, and boring head.

With the DTI, I can achieve acceptable alignment to bore an existing hole on center. But . . .

. . . how do I lock down the tables? I can't figure out how to do it, and it looks to be essential when using a single-point rotary cutting tool on tables with the kind of leadscrew backlash this old thing has. Any clues? Click on some of the pics I took and zoom in: does anyone see anything on the tables other than gib adjustments? I am out of my depth here.
Last edited by asavage 11 years ago, edited 1 time in total.
Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.

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TooManyIdeas
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#10

Post by TooManyIdeas » 13 years ago

While not being completely familiar with your machine if I had to guess the 2 bolts marked in yellow MAY be your stops. Or they could very well be oil fills. I think they may be stops because the seem to line up perfectly with the dovetail ways. Check the other axis of the table if you see another bolt setup (probably only 1 instead of 2).

If this is not the case, you may be able to cheat a little. the area just below the surface of the table are the adjustable stops. What you can do is adjust the two stops against the fixed stop in the middle.

Using a C-clamp or something, get the table where you want it.
Loosen the stops clamp them to the fixed stop and retighten the adjustables. Yes I admit it is redneck but that may work.

Or (marked in green) you could tighten the ways allot. I'd recommend swapping out the flat screws for some allen head caps. That may also work

Image

p.s. a really good tool for finding center on a hole is called a coaxial indicator.
82 Datsun 720 King Cab Diesel - FOR SALE !!!!
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#11

Post by asavage » 13 years ago

TooManyIdeas wrote:While not being completely familiar with your machine if I had to guess the 2 bolts marked in yellow MAY be your stops.
They're gib adjusts:
Image
Image
Check the other axis of the table if you see another bolt setup (probably only 1 instead of 2).
Yup, right on.

Do you advocate locking down the tables by overtightening the gibs? Having no experience in this area, I don't know what's proper.
the area just below the surface of the table are the adjustable stops. What you can do is adjust the two stops against the fixed stop in the middle.
Oh. Yeah, that'll work for the X-axis.
Or (marked in green) you could tighten the ways allot. I'd recommend swapping out the flat screws for some allen head caps. That may also work
I don't know that the slotted screws can be swapped out -- they are special.

Better (?) pic:
Image Image
p.s. a really good tool for finding center on a hole is called a coaxial indicator.
Ah, I hadn't seen one of those before. Yeah, I can see where it has advantages over a DTI and a mirror-on-a-stick. Not cheap though. If I was doing a lot of bores . . . there are a lot of tools and adapters etc. that look like they make jobs much easier. I don't -- yet -- have a need or budget for most of them. Actually, I can forsee outgrowing this Jet-16 fast, but for now it's opened up so many possibilities that I'm still in the honeymoon phase.

I know begin to know how much I do not know.
Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.

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TooManyIdeas
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#12

Post by TooManyIdeas » 13 years ago

The way I've always seen gib adjustments, there is a goofy looking wedge between the dovetails on the bed and table. They would be adjusted by tightening and loosening the flat head screws (which your machine is equiped with) on both sides of the gib. since the bid is a wedge shape, when tightened in one direction it will loosen and when tightened in the other it will tighten. Every machine I've every used had the same style gib adjustment. Now with that being said seeing the service manual pic leads me to believe the 2 bolts that force the gibs into the dovetail is your table lock (or at least can be used as such).
Do I advocate using the side to side gib adjustment as a lock? No not really. But the 2 bolts in the front I think would work just fine as a table lock.

Just a quick question does your machine have a lot of slop in the handles or maybe very tight?
82 Datsun 720 King Cab Diesel - FOR SALE !!!!
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#13

Post by asavage » 13 years ago

Leadscrew slop:

X = .025" indicated
Y = .020" indicated

Seems like a lot [shrug].

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TooManyIdeas
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#14

Post by TooManyIdeas » 13 years ago

It is alot I wasn't sure but after getting those numbers I'm pretty sure you need to adjust your gibs anyway. the handles will turn abit stiffer but the play should be reduced. Also oil or atleast grease the ways and gibs frequently.
82 Datsun 720 King Cab Diesel - FOR SALE !!!!
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#15

Post by asavage » 13 years ago

I'm confused again.

The slop in the handles is influenced by the gibs??? I thought it was leadscrew-to-nut clearance (which, Dad tells me, is adjustable on better equipment). And perhaps the leadscrew thrust brgs.

Ref. Nos. 155 & 163 are the leadscrew nuts:
Image

[later]

A cursory inspection (ie: I looked hard at it) seems to indicate a lot of lost leadscrew thrust motion: the indicating dial rings move in/out visibly. Feeler-gauge range, but visible.

[after some feeler gauge play]

About .010" on the Y-axis, .013" on the X-axis. Don't know what's "normal".

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