Engine swap - Am I crazy?

[Sentientpuppet]

Hi I'm new here, asavage pointed me here from craigslist a while back when I was looking for an sd22 engine to drop into my 84 KC gasser. Anyway I'm trying to decide whether this is beyond my capabilities. I know next to nothing about diesel engines besides the basics. I have done tons of work on my Z24 engine though, completely rebuilt the head and striped everything except for the block itself... I'm a completely self taught mechanic straight outa the haynes and chiltons manuals.
Now I've been told by a few people that I'm crazy trying to get my hands into a diesel because diesel work needs to be very precice and whatever. Am I going into something way outa my legue? Can I just follow the manual the way I always have? or is the diesel engine way too complicated and outa my range?

[philip]

Hi I'm new here, asavage pointed me here from craigslist a while back when I was looking for an sd22 engine to drop into my 84 KC gasser. Anyway I'm trying to decide whether this is beyond my capabilities. I know next to nothing about diesel engines besides the basics. I have done tons of work on my Z24 engine though, completely rebuilt the head and striped everything except for the block itself... I'm a completely self taught mechanic straight outa the haynes and chiltons manuals.
Now I've been told by a few people that I'm crazy trying to get my hands into a diesel because diesel work needs to be very precice and whatever. Am I going into something way outa my legue? Can I just follow the manual the way I always have? or is the diesel engine way too complicated and outa my range?

First, welcome to our sandbox.

Transplants / repowers are seldom covered adequately in books on the subject. For example, here is a Samurai / SD repower.

There are differences in the electrical subsystems between your Z and an SD depending on your desire to have electric fuel control vs. a manual push/pull cable.

The alternator on the SD has a vacuum pump to run the vacuum booster for your brakes.

The fuel tank connections are quite similar but you MUST add the additional secondary spin-on fuel filter (Fuel syst schematic).

The catalytic converter and fuel tank filler restriction must be removed. A trip to the DMV and possibly a referree smog station for a new smog compliance status will mean no more biannual smog checks in many states ... but not all. So don't toss the EGR valve stuff found on the SD22 diesel!

The SD's starter is on the left side of the vehicle next to the steering colum so you must find the transmission bell housing for the SD (5spd gearbox)

The motor mounts on the vehicle right side are a bit different but your '84 should have the additional mounting holes on the frame that relocate the mount about an inch further forward (Motor mount pads).

If your truck now has A/C and/or Power Steering, your SD must have the unique bracketry to accomodate the A/C compressor and Power Steering pump.

Air intake track and exhaust system are both on the vehicle's left side.

That's just the big stuff off the top of my head at 05:00.

[Sentientpuppet]

cool thanks for the info, I have been reading posts here and elsewhere about making the conversion. and thats not exactly where my doubts lie. I'm mostly worried about working on a diesel engine in general. People talk about diesel work being something only a trained professional should do.

[asavage]

The internals of the SD22 are much like many gassers. The differences are in the intake and fuel systems. You don't go inside the injection pump unless you are prepared to scrap it. You can do some work with the injectors themselves, though cleanliness is a must, and economically it's better (IMO) to just remove and replace them, letting professionals do the refurbishing and testing. Adjusting the valves is the same as on many gassers. No carburetor, no ignition system.

The major hurdles you will face are the 4WD interface (if used) and the automatic transmission (if used). Additionally, the gasser's fuel tank is likely galvanized, and diesel + zinc don't mix, so you may want to investigate replacing the fuel tank as well.

The exhaust -- at least the headpipe -- will need to be fabricated, not a big deal.

If you retain the IPC controller (search on that term for more info), you'll have a bit of wiring to do. Ditto with the OEM glow plug control system. Armed with a Factory Service Manual, it's do-able. Don't even attempt the electrical work without a FSM.

[philip]

cool thanks for the info, I have been reading posts here and elsewhere about making the conversion. and thats not exactly where my doubts lie. I'm mostly worried about working on a diesel engine in general. People talk about diesel work being something only a trained professional should do.

Ah! You have reservations about the operational theory of diesel. Yes, there are some guarded arenas of Sacred Knowledge (ie fuel injection pump service/adjustment, injectors, & combustion theory to name only a few). In the trade, Guardians of these sacred arenas grudgingly relinquish teachings when you demonstrate logical thought processes to them and bestow compensation (buy their services, parts, labor, supply pizza or doughnuts) for their teachings. The diesel industry IS more than a bit cliquish.

Here's a primer for you:

Combustion Cackle

Injectors

[asavage]

HowStuffWorks.com seems to be a good primer on diesel tech as well -- except that their ShockWaveFlash animation says, "Compressed Air" where it should say, "Compressed Fuel"

[Sentientpuppet]

thanks guys and especially you asavage for already helping me out so much in our previous emails. Do you still have that parts truck by the way? I won't be attempting the swap problably for another month because I'm so busy at work right now on top of moving at the same time but anyone else here on the forums that have parts and are live somewhere near western washington, please let me know. I have a good running engine I'll just need all the odds and ends that you guys have mentioned and I'm currently looking for a good tranny.

[asavage]

Do you still have that parts truck by the way?

It belongs to Peter Sigmond, who is in harbor until Monday, then goes to sea for three weeks. Yes, he still has the Vashon 720. I do not think that the transmission is available though. Probably can get the wiring harness if you want. And if you have A/C and want to retain it, you'll need the A/C stuff that fits the SD22, which he has on his "driver" and is willing to sell, though not for too cheap. 720 diesels with A/C are not common (Philip owns one).

[Sentientpuppet]

ok is he on this board? where is the truck currently? I live in federal way so meeting in seattle would be best for me but not for at least a couple weeks.

[Sentientpuppet]

ok is he on this board? where is the truck currently? I live in federal way so meeting in seattle would be best for me but not for at least a couple weeks.

[Sentientpuppet]

Ya know you're problably going to be trippin when you read this but I was origionally wanting to make this switch because I want to run WVO. I have a friend that runs his VW jetta on WVO. But now I've been reading your posts about the damage this can cause and I'm a little hesitant now. I thought I could be saving the environment and my money by doing this but it seems otherwise. I'd like to run biodiesel straight but I don't have that kind of money. How much does it cost right now?
If I were to run strictly Filtered and boiled preheated veggie oil would it be completely stupid? am I wasting my time?

[philip]

SNIP I'd like to run biodiesel straight but I don't have that kind of money. How much does it cost right now?

I cannot speak to your area of Federal Way but way south in the east Los Angeles area is my 'nearest' B20 and B99 outlet called Spirit Truckstop.

Check here for their pricing ... which I image to be representative:

Biodiesel Pricing

[asavage]

ok is he on this board?

Peter is computerless -- you have to call him. I think I emailed his phone number to you?

where is the truck currently?

I hauled it to Marrowstone Island; it has since been moved, though I'm not sure to where. I suspect it's now in Irondale. At any rate, it's within 20 miles of Port Townsend.

I live in federal way so meeting in seattle would be best for me but not for at least a couple weeks.

Meeting? I don't think Peter is going to go to Seattle anytime soon. But you'll need to discuss that with him.

[asavage]

I thought I could be saving the environment and my money by doing this but it seems otherwise.

Money? In the short term, yes. If you are very, very careful, you can spend less cash on fuel. However, what's your time worth? For most people I know, you could mow an extra lawn once per month and earn enough dough to pay for the difference -- and you wouldn't have to collect "free" fryer oil, nor filter it, nor wonder what other crap is in it.

Making biodiesel from fryer oil -- with testing of every batch -- converts the unknown to the better known, but then you have to work with methanol and lye, and you have to dispose of the glycerin.

If you have to buy one injection pump rebuild, or one extra set of injectors, or you cut the usable life of your diesel engine by 40k miles, then how much money have you "saved"?

Then there's the tailpipe emissions. Google Acrolien, it's not pretty. Can you spell "mutagenic"?

I'd like to run biodiesel straight but I don't have that kind of money. How much does it cost right now?

Biodiesel is not a money-saving proposition right now. People don't buy BD to save money, they buy it for other reasons. It's better for your engine, your environment, your world, your politics. It's not cheaper than heavily subsidized petrodiesel. I get better mileage with my diesels than my gasser, so I am not paying "more" by running BD over gasoline, only in comparison with petrodiesel am I spending"more". I don't care -- my fuel budget is not that sensitive.

If I were to run strictly Filtered and boiled preheated veggie oil would it be completely stupid? am I wasting my time?

I don't know what boiling fryer oil will do -- remove the water? You'll spend a lot of electricity getting each gallon of oil up to water's boiling point, and a lot more to get to the boiling point of fryer oil. Up here in the PNW, that's trading the killing of wild fish runs for fuel processing -- our power is predominantly hydroelectric, and the more water we use to make electricity, the less we can afford to spill over the spillways to allow fish to migrate around the dams we've put on all major rivers up here.

Filtering. Filter bags are pretty cheap individually, but 5 micron and 1 micron bags take a long time to gravity process WVO -- at least at reasonable temperatures. And then you throw them away -- landfill. Do not dream that you can get away with filtering coarser than 5 micron, the IP will not last.

You have to start up and shut down on either petrodiesel or BD, every time. Can you do that? Without fail? Does anyone else use your vehicle? Can they be trained? The first time you don't follow the steps is the last time you'll be able to start the engine without the hassle of a lot of congealed WVO all over the place. You'll have to purge the WVO out of the injection system, and it won't want to pump so you'll be pulling lines off and blowing them down, spewing smelly fryer oil all over, which is ever worse to deal with than PD -- at least the PD does eventually evaporate (the fryer oil won't), and the WVO will grow crap wherever it lands if you don't wash it off with soap.

There are a lot of downsides to burning untransesterified fryer oil in a diesel engine.

[Sentientpuppet]

It belongs to Peter Sigmond, who is in harbor until Monday, then goes to sea for three weeks.

I took Sea to mean seattle, apparently this is not seattle? I have no Idea where that is.
and I just checked our old email convos and no I didn't get a phone number in there.

I think I have made up my mind to run biodiesel and possibly make a portion of it on my own.
I spent a lot of time on journeytoforever last night researching... I'm just that sorta DIY save money kinda person. Besides I'm interested in the process and would like to go back to college to work with alternate fuels.