New, clean GM diesel engine, but not for the US

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dieseldorf
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New, clean GM diesel engine, but not for the US

#1

Post by dieseldorf » 12 years ago

Read this:
http://www.autoblog.com/2007/03/06/gene ... l-for-cts/
and this:
http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a ... /505130704
Do we still want to be more independend from foreign oil?
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asavage
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Re: New, clean GM diesel engine, but not for the US

#2

Post by asavage » 12 years ago

2.9l & 250 HP: that's 100cc larger than our 80 HP LD28.
Quite well written (except for the misspelling of "spectre", or maybe they meant Arlen Specter?).
Do we still want to be more independent from foreign oil?
Naw, we want to OWN the foreign oil :roll:

davehoos
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#3

Post by davehoos » 12 years ago

i was looking for a news comment from GM usa that there is no place for diesels in passenger cars-that they loose money on sales and they only sell in countries the subsidise the fuel costs and that chrysler plan to sell small diesels in USA will bankrupt them.

http://yahoo.drive.com.au/Editorial/Art ... 44033&vf=1

there is a lot of coments in australia about how the cars we get are crap.this artical blames the USA for the poor quality of the new engine range thats down on performance over the old buick V6.it comes across that the commodore we get is the left overs after export orders are filled,the ford isnt exported so there is no hurry there to do anything.the aust gov payed ford to fit a diesel,it take a few years and millions to fit a left over truck engine that is questionable[landrover]-it takes a few mechanic a week to do the same.mitubishi closed the factory.

GM-H had diesels since the 50,s[perkins]but went out of there way to talk them down,in the mid 70,s they had light truck engines.ford has a good LPG engine but it gets scraped in 2010.

http://carsguide.news.com.au/site/motor ... r_go_bust/

http://carsguide.news.com.au/site/motor ... _electric/
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asavage
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#4

Post by asavage » 12 years ago

davehoos wrote:i was looking for a news comment from GM usa that there is no place for diesels in passenger cars-that they loose money on sales and they only sell in countries the subsidise the fuel costs and that chrysler plan to sell small diesels in USA will bankrupt them.

http://yahoo.drive.com.au/Editorial/Art ... 44033&vf=1
They have a point, if the numbers quoted are correct. If European diesel is truly 40% cheaper than petrol at the pump, that's an enormous incentive for customers to buy diesel and pay more up front for the option.

And, if as quoted, the price of diesel in Australia is higher than petrol, who will pay more for the diesel engine option? Slightly higher fuel economy is much harder to sell in that situation.

I do like this picture in that article, though:
Image
A Cadillac STS fitted with a prototype diesel motor, believed to be a 3.0-litre V6, spews out smoke during trials in southern Europe last week. Cadillac is owned by Holden parent General Motors. Picture: Automedia
Looks like an LD28-powered STS!

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#5

Post by davehoos » 12 years ago

i think the photo was used as a political statement,there are other articles in other places like diesel causes cancer and child delinquency,also that our problems in australia are caused by idiots in the usa that cant design cars.we have TV stories shown on australian TV from the USA that again claim that the aust built pontiac was as bad as the ford capri convertable exported in the 80,s.

for the olympics gm made hybrid cars that worked and there are calls for hybrid/electrics to be built here for export.local government is planing to built recyle plants to convert garbage into crued oil.this is not the light oil used by most to run in diesel cars-but good crued that makes good diesel.

today there has been a bombshell against the greenies pointing out that australia exports almost no coal to china for coal powered power stations and very little for steel production and china is a coal exporter.not talking about the smog over california from china.they have been blocking of roads and ports etc demanding windmills and public transport.

diesel can be as much as 10% more than 91 ULP petrol.but cheeper than high octane fuel.the point of a diesel car is that its slow moving in traffic all day and efficient running on crap fuel.diesel cars sold here today are not of this type and for the fuel cost option lpg works out at half the cost of LPG but due to the lack of interest in design there is no room for tanks in modern cars and this is more of a concern with taxi/fleet sales.

a reasonable % of people here will line up for a diesel car if it was sold at a reasonable price like in other countries.i dont think the same fact would be true in the usa.you have a large supply of cheep used cars.

in the past diesels sold for over 20% more than a petrol and with high repair costs and poor performance.the same car/light truck in europe was cheeper.

its often pointed out that the best selling[profit] car in australia was the fairlane from the end of the 60,s.it was built by bean counters using parts left over for amercan models.the larger fairlane was grafted onto a falcon wagon and was a overnight sales sucsess.
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#6

Post by glenlloyd » 12 years ago

I would agree with Al, the points made in the article are valid. And yes, Europe does have significantly cheaper diesel at the pump. I certainly wish we had diesel that was 40% cheaper than petrol.

I doubt very highly that we'll see much from GM here with diesel power. We will eventually see the 2.9 mentioned in the article, they've admitted that already, but they're dragging their heels on anything else. GM just doesn't feel like there's a market for econobox cars with diesel power that cost more than the gasoline counterparts. GM has said that the numbers just don't work.

What I find odd is that VW has managed to essentially sneak diesel back into the US beginning in the mid-90's and make it work financially but our own manufacturers here in the US can't.
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goglio704
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#7

Post by goglio704 » 12 years ago

Jeep sold something like twice the number of CRD Liberty's they expected, but that was before diesel was 60 cents higher than premium unleaded.
Matt B.

83 Maxima Sedan, LD28, 5 speed, white, 130k miles. My original Maxima.
83 Maxima Sedan converted from gasser, LD28, 5 speed, 2 tone blue, 230k miles
82 Maxima Sedan, LD28, 3 speed auto, 2 tone Gray/Silver, 140k miles
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2005 Jeep Liberty CRD

redmondjp
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conspiracy?

#8

Post by redmondjp » 12 years ago

I know this is beating a dead horse, but I am thoroughly convinced that there is one simple reason why we don't have more diesel engines here: the oil companies. Every other developed nation in the world except ours has passenger car diesels (if I'm wrong on this, please chime in) and we don't (with a few exceptions, such as a very limited number of VWs, Mercedes & Jeeps).

Does anybody remember in the early 1980s when VW was selling MORE diesel rabbits than gas ones in this country? Yes, that is correct--it was something like 53% diesel to 47% gas. Then of course people were put off by the 350 'diesel' debacle, not to mention the .99/gal gas that pretty much killed off the passenger car diesel after that.

And what's even more amazing is how clueless the general population is today about how much better fuel mileage they could be getting if they had a diesel engine in their existing vehicle. The whole diesel-in-a-car (or passenger truck) craze really got started back in the mid 1970s during the fuel crisis (hence a Nissan diesel in an International Scout, who'd a' thunk it). I had a friend give me a collection of PV 4x4 magazines from the mid 1960s through the mid 1980s (every single issue), and I scanned almost every one before recycling them (this was years ago, B4 ebay, and I couldn't imagine anybody wanting them). I was amazed at how many different 4x4 rigs got diesels (usually tiny 4-cyl ones with 60 hp) put into them.

OK, rant off, but if more people from here got over to Europe and drove some of those highly-refined diesel vehicles (which I guarantee you most people wouldn't even realize were diesel until somebody told them--they are that smooth and quiet), they would come back with a new-found appreciation of the technology (and would be more pissed off that they aren't available here!).
1982 Datsun 720 King Cab, SD22, 86K miles (sold)
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dieseldorf
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it is frustrating

#9

Post by dieseldorf » 12 years ago

Ford introduces a new crossover in Europe. It is a diesel!
What is wrong with this country :evil:
http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/02/14 ... el-option/
Astro Van with LD28 propulsion
'84 Mercedes 190D 2.2L 5-Speed Manual purchased 06/12 SOLD 06/13
'86 Ford Escort Wagon Diesel MT Sold 07-17-08

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