Starter.Finding the correct one for a 1982 720

Dealing with all subsystems specific to the diesel powered Datsun-Nissan 720 pickup trucks.

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dn29626
Posts: 249
Joined: 11 years ago
Location: Anderson, SC

Starter.Finding the correct one for a 1982 720

#1

Post by dn29626 »

I have ordered two starters through Advance Auto and sent them back. Each is listed as DD for a diesel but the solenoid is on the open side and would be on bottom when mounted. I do not believe there is enough block clearance for the solenoid to be at the bottom.

Picture of starter
http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/webapp ... 1335519398___#

Here is a picture of block clearance

Doesn't the solenoid have to be on the closed side to fit the truck?

I am about to try one from napa.
82 King Cab 2wd (nice)
82 Reg Cab (body damage)
Anderson , SC
Since Fall 2009
dn29626
Posts: 249
Joined: 11 years ago
Location: Anderson, SC

#2

Post by dn29626 »

I ordered/picked-up this starter from napa today.
http://www.napaonline.com/Search/Detail ... 18+2018013
It is listed as direct drive so I complained that it does not look direct drive. The older counter salesmen insisted it is direct drive. It measures 9.25 inches long from mount to end of motor. The same as the starter i removed.
(It looks the same as the pictures of the GR starter available from Autozone or Oreilly's for $89.99 plus core which i did not order BECAUSE they are GR.)
At least this one will fit. I plan to install it to get the truck going, but i am frustrated because i am not satisfied.
82 King Cab 2wd (nice)
82 Reg Cab (body damage)
Anderson , SC
Since Fall 2009
plenzen
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Joined: 14 years ago
Location: Cochrane Alberta Canada

#3

Post by plenzen »

http://nissandiesel.dyndns.org/viewtopi ... 0996#10996

This is the link to the starter that I rebuilt for my SD25. The top three pictures in the series are of the Hitachi GR starter. ( The black starter ) there are also some photos there of another GR type starter for a Nissan SD engine that goes into a fork lift. If you notice the solonoid portion is indexed incorrectly much like the photo of your O'Reily starter. That (O'Reily) starter may be for a forklift apllication. :?: :?: The main difference ( other than how they actually work ) is the pinion end of it. There is no armature ( main shaft) support bearing on the tip. The DD type has a bearing or bushing at the end of that shaft, while the GR type is simply the pinion gear.

HTH

Paul
Retired Pauly
Problem with being retired is that you never get a day off.
1987 D21-J SD25 KC
KJLGD21FN
dn29626
Posts: 249
Joined: 11 years ago
Location: Anderson, SC

#4

Post by dn29626 »

I visited the oreilly site again. It shows Beck/Arnley 187-0354. It appears to be a DD starter for $157.99. More than i want to pay, but if it is DD...
http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detai ... &ppt=C0330
82 King Cab 2wd (nice)
82 Reg Cab (body damage)
Anderson , SC
Since Fall 2009
dn29626
Posts: 249
Joined: 11 years ago
Location: Anderson, SC

#5

Post by dn29626 »

I ordered the Beck/Arnley 187-0354 starter today from Oreillys.
http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detai ... &ppt=C0330
82 King Cab 2wd (nice)
82 Reg Cab (body damage)
Anderson , SC
Since Fall 2009
dn29626
Posts: 249
Joined: 11 years ago
Location: Anderson, SC

#6

Post by dn29626 »

Another GR starter. It is labeled 187-0354. The paperwork says DD, but it is a GR.
Oreillys is reordering for me. Sadly, i expect another GR will arrive.

I took my old one apart. 4 revolutions of the motor equals one revolution of the gear.
82 King Cab 2wd (nice)
82 Reg Cab (body damage)
Anderson , SC
Since Fall 2009
Nissan_Ranger
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Joined: 14 years ago
Location: Canada

#7

Post by Nissan_Ranger »

So how did this finally work out? What did you end up with and where did you get it?
The old 'six gun' was as popular as the cell phone in its time and just as annoying when it went off in the Theater.
dn29626
Posts: 249
Joined: 11 years ago
Location: Anderson, SC

#8

Post by dn29626 »

I told Oreillys i was willing to pay the price but would only accept a DD. I recommended they tell their supplier of my position on this.
Oreillys did a reorder on the Beck/Arnley 187-0354 starter and got a DD. I was/am thrilled.
They called this type order a "factory direct" and i had to pay the freight. I got what i wanted so i am OK with the freight charge.
82 King Cab 2wd (nice)
82 Reg Cab (body damage)
Anderson , SC
Since Fall 2009
Nissan_Ranger
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Location: Canada

#9

Post by Nissan_Ranger »

Excellent! How does that starter work compared to the old GR?
The old 'six gun' was as popular as the cell phone in its time and just as annoying when it went off in the Theater.
dn29626
Posts: 249
Joined: 11 years ago
Location: Anderson, SC

#10

Post by dn29626 »

It spins the engine faster and i have been able to start the engine below freezing.
82 King Cab 2wd (nice)
82 Reg Cab (body damage)
Anderson , SC
Since Fall 2009
Cmdr. Ron
Posts: 23
Joined: 10 years ago
Location: Middleburg, Fla., U.S. of A.

DD vs. GR Question

#11

Post by Cmdr. Ron »

:?:
Well, now, this has me a wee bit confoosed here.
I have been going about for a number of years with the idea Gear Reduction starters spin faster than Direct Drive starters, but are smaller & lighter.
Am I incorrect in this?
Did that happen again? :shock: :oops:
'82 DATSUN 720 SD22, '77 Fiat 124 Spider, '81 Toyota HiLux, '64 Chevy Corvair Monza
The Blessing of Abraham is mine!
dn29626
Posts: 249
Joined: 11 years ago
Location: Anderson, SC

Re: DD vs. GR Question

#12

Post by dn29626 »

Cmdr. Ron wrote::?:
Well, now, this has me a wee bit confoosed here.
I have been going about for a number of years with the idea Gear Reduction starters spin faster than Direct Drive starters, but are smaller & lighter.
Am I incorrect in this?
Did that happen again? :shock: :oops:
The cranking (spin) is usually based on the size of the engine and starter torque.
Direct drive cranks our small nissan engines (2.2 and 2.5) faster. 1:1 ratio.
The gear reduction starter motor must spin four times to turn the drive once. 4:1 ratio.
We all know a diesel engine starts easier when it cranks quickly.

My 2001 F350 diesel 7.3 has to use the GR starter. A DD could not handle it. I do not think DD is even available for it.
82 King Cab 2wd (nice)
82 Reg Cab (body damage)
Anderson , SC
Since Fall 2009
charmalu
Posts: 166
Joined: 10 years ago
Location: Soquel, Calif

#13

Post by charmalu »

When I bought the truck back in 81, it came with a gear reduction starter. I pulled the engine at 234k to rering, ovr haul etc... I dropped the starter off at a shop to have it checked over. guy said the bearings were dry, and replaced them. I put the starter back in, and at 432K I replaced it with a rebuilt one. as far as I know, it was on the original brushes.

The rebuild was a direct drive starter, and I will say it spins the engine over w/o any problems. the old gear reduction starter was getting tird, and was turning the engine over slower and slower.
But it never failed to turn the engine over.

The new starter has been in about 6 years now, and still works good.
That old Gear Reduction start was the longest lived starter I have ever seen. think I will have it gold plated and mounted. :D

there is or was a large starter/alternator rebuild shop in San Jose, CA. off Hwy-17 and Camden ave. think I paid $135.

Charlie
82 Datsun KC 483K lost #2 cyl blowing blue smoke :cry:
83 Nissan LB 134K SD-25 as of 10-21-13
78 240D Mercedes $300 Parts?
80 240D 360K
80 240D Parts? $750
82 240D Parts? $440
84 300SD 270K
85 300D 363K
86 Ford F250 6.9 Diesel 221K
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asavage
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Re: DD vs. GR Question

#14

Post by asavage »

dn29626 wrote:My 2001 F350 diesel 7.3 has to use the GR starter. A DD could not handle it. I do not think DD is even available for it.
The 6.0l IH IDI engine, pre-Powerstroke, 1983-1987, had Delco DD starters. There is a common GR starter replacement that folks seem to like more. Personally, I like the Delco DD starter, and it spins the 6.9l over great.

IIRC, the IDI 6.9l/7.3l engines have a higher compression ratio than the DI Powerstroke. Let me go check . . .

7.3l PS = 17.5:1 CR
6.9l IDI = 20.7 CR

I don't think you can generalize that larger diesel engines are more suitable for GR starters. I've seen examples both ways, and both seem to work OK.
Regards,
Al S.

1982 Maxima diesel wagon, 2nd & 4th owner, 165k miles, rusty & burgundy/grey. Purchased 1996, SOLD 16Feb10
1983 Maxima diesel wagon, 199k miles, rusty, light yellow/light brown. SOLD 14Jul07
1981 720 SD22 (scrapped 04Sep07)
1983 Sentra CD17, 255k, bought 06Jul08, gave it away 22Jun10.
dn29626
Posts: 249
Joined: 11 years ago
Location: Anderson, SC

Re: DD vs. GR Question

#15

Post by dn29626 »

asavage wrote:
dn29626 wrote:...I do not think DD is even available for it....
...I don't think you can generalize that larger diesel engines are more suitable for GR starters...
I think we can generalize because there is a limit on size and space available.
82 King Cab 2wd (nice)
82 Reg Cab (body damage)
Anderson , SC
Since Fall 2009
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