Engine Swap

[lacolocho]

Would anyone have any interest in putting an SD engine into a gas King Cab for/with me?
I have pretty limited knowledge, but really want a diesel KC.
But I can be a helping hand...

I'm in Portland, and would be interested in doing this in the early spring.

I can definitely pay some money, but would also be into trying to figure out something I could trade in addition to the cash.

[asavage]

While I might be interested in helping, I'm really not geographically close enough to you. And I really have to believe that it'd be cheaper to just buy a KC diesel truck -- I sold my "good" '82 720 KC diesel for $2000 about two years ago, it had 86k original miles on it, and is the one shown in the Biodiesel fuel lines replacement thread. That $2000 was a bit high for this market, but I could -- and did -- charge a premium price for that one, even though it was cosmetically challenged, because it ran perfectly and had a good record.

I bought a beater 720 KC for $150 a year ago, non-running but an easy fix to get running, lots of wiring and rust issues but a driver. It's the one we're scrapping to put its engine/trans in the '86 gasser non-KC.

Rust is a big issue on these 720s. I've passed up several cheap gasser donors for rust issues. The '86 I settled on isn't KC (wish it was) but for $50 it was the least rusty and straightest I'd run across in several months looking. And though it was supposed to have a blown head gasket, a new ign rotor got it running, and it's being driven now! (Anybody need a well-worn Z24? I'll make you a heckofadeal!)

Any truck you buy is going to be 20+ yrs old and is going to need something. But unless you have an SD engine/trans and a good gasser PU already, I can't help but think that the least-cost out is to buy the truck already being diesel.

OTOH . . . just tossing numbers out here . . . if you have the SD engine/trans and a complete gasser KC PU, and we limit the scope of the project to just the changeover (ie no work that is unrelated to the swap, like brakes or front suspension work), I suppose I could dolly the thing up here to my shop and do the swap. I will have done Peter's swap already by that time (hopefully before the end of this year) and will be documenting what we have to do. It's quite close to a bolt-in I believe, with the exception of the wiring and exhaust (custom headpipe required).

I'd figure about $900. That would include transport of a non-running PU from PDX to where I am, and back (two round trips for me with a tow dolly), which is $150 of fuel. I'd furnish the custom headpipe -- I have a very good exhaust fabricator up here -- you'd have to obtain the radiator, fuel tank. I'd fab the motor mountings (if required). I'll make the stock IPC/DPC system work if you want, and the GP system as well. I will not modify the dash wiring except to wire the EGR lamp to be the GP Wait lamp (or add a separate lamp, if that's easier).

But by the time you paid me that, you'd be halfway to buying a diesel KC 720 already. And having done this kind of thing before, I know I would just break even on the job, even at that price. My time isn't particularly cheap anymore. I don't really want to do this job, but if you threw enough cash at me (or found me another L4N71b trans to fit an LD28), I'd have to.

[lacolocho]

well thanks for your honesty, your replies are always really helpful.
I've just been looking everywhere for a diesel KC for 4 months and I've found a total of 3 running ones. One was a rust bucket that sold for $2800 on ebay, one was a damn good deal that sold before i could get it, and another was too rusty for me to care.

I guess I'll just keep my eyes open for a few more months.
If anyone sees one anywhere in the NW I'd definitely appreciate an email at lacolocho@gmail.com

[asavage]

You might put a post over in the Peddle & Procure it forum. I know that's where I'd go to search for you when one comes up.

I search eBay and CL regularly, and they do come along. That blue one in Seattle about two months ago sold very fast. If you got beyond the "touch-up paint", it wasn't too bad. A co-worker was seriously considering buying it, but it was sold within a day at that price.

AdamsGarage sometimes gets one, like this one, but again you have to watch out for rusty floors.

Anyway, 720 KC diesel trucks can be had, but every one of them is going to be a "fixer" in some way, because they're old. There are no "trouble-free" 20-yr-old trucks.

[lacolocho]

I saw that Adamsgarage one a while back, but it seemed too rusty

I expect them to have some rust issues, and some issues in general.

I'd rather find one with more mechanical issues than rust, b/c those are easier to fix.

[greyfoxxca]

use the b2200 mazda
You will likely lose your powersteering but it is a better end vehicle. The mazda rad fits, the motormounts go right in and the tranny mounts have to be elongated. You will have to modify the driveshaft but I believe it is a easier swap than into a nissan. My b2200 diesel is a great little truck.

by the way everyone the 4x4 swap is an everending pain as when you take your tranny apart you will want to change bearings. Also the modified oilpan does cause clearance issues with the instalation bolts. The emergency brake cable ends up on the exhaust etc. Front end issues will also show up.

cheers
George

[greyfoxxca]

By the way Al in both of my swaps I have not changed the fuel tanks. The ones on the gas trucks were quite covered with rust I surmised that zinc coatings were not as common as thought. No filter problems so far. So I do have some spare diesel fuel tanks.
cheers
George

[TheDieseliminator]

I'm thinking the gas to diesel conversion on an 83-86 720 is quite possibly doable now that I've thought about it more. Last weekend my dad and I took a trip to a local junkyard that we'd always thought wasn't much of a diesel specific and Japanese vehicle yard. The junkyard is heavily into Dodge/Mopar products, but the good thing is they own like 3 or 4 Dodge Cummins diesel trucks. They also have an old Caterpillar yard tractor that they use to pick up the junk cars and stuff and it's a piece of history in itself. They started that unit up and you could hear it from the other end of the yard. Gotta love those older diesels! Well anyways we started talking to the yard owner about what diesel vehicles, if any he had in his yard. He said he had at a point in time a Chevette, 720, and Mitsu pickup all being diesels. No longer has any of them and the stuff is getting dryed up as far as finding it in yards these days. Well he said go outback of the office because when they crushed the Nissan 720 they happened to keep the diesel engine out of it (which was only smart). We went back and next to a pile of many transmissions, sitting in some short grass all by itself was an SD22 engine with no trans (unfortunately). The bad thing is chances are it may not turn over but it does look like it may have not had much exposure to the atmosphere over the years and possibly might turn over. That junkyard is roughly only 20 miles away and isn't a problem as far as distance. Price he is asking for the unit is $200, which isn't horrible but I think it should be cheaper in my opinion. So turns out the above yard was quite diesel oriented, we didn't know, and communication is key. Now he is one of our best friends, haha. There is another junkyard about 20 miles away that also has an SD22 engine that they've had stored in their warehouse for the past 10-15 years with only 80k original miles. That probably turns over and they'd want just about the same price as the other yard, but once again no trans there too. Then at a third and final yard there is an 85 or 86 Nissan kingcab pickup in decent shape that had the Z24 gas engine in it from the factory. If I remember correctly it didn't have the engine anymore and is a great candidate to pop in one of those SD22s in. I'd really like to truly confirm the older application SD22 would fit into that newer frame given the truck is a later model 720. I would think it would and probably be a bolt-in on the frame. If so that's all that matters, as long as that engine is a bolt-in I don't mind adapting the transmission to the chassis if it needs to be done. That truck isn't in bad shape for being just over 20 years old and it be a runner pretty quick after you of course convert it and get it efficiently running diesel. Al, you'll actually know if the SD22 is a bolt-in on an 86 720 because of that conversion you're doing into that single cab truck I remember you said you were going to do. Any updates on that?

Salvy

[asavage]

A followup.

By the way Al in both of my swaps I have not changed the fuel tanks. The ones on the gas trucks were quite covered with rust I surmised that zinc coatings were not as common as thought. No filter problems so far. So I do have some spare diesel fuel tanks.

I just ran across this today, in an Onan "Mechanical/Electrical Fundamentals" manual I bought recently. (Pg 15)

Diesel fuel systems should never use galvanized fuel lines, fittings or fuel tanks. Condensation in the tanks and lines combines with the sulphur in diesel fuel to produce sulfuric acid. The zinc coating on galvanized lines or tanks reacts with the acid and flackes off to contaminate the fuel.

This doesn't imply that there is galvanizing inside Nissan 720 gasser fuel tanks, only that if there is, it could be a problem when switching to diesel in them.

[philip]

"condensation...combines with the sulfur in diesel fuel ..."

WHAT sulfur? 15ppm is a far cry from the old days of 500ppm.

[asavage]

And 500 ppm is a far cry from pre-1990 when suphur content was essentially unregulated in vehicle fuel (or was it? Haven't researched).

The manual I was quoting was published 12/83. You should see the dress and hairstyles of the man and woman pictured on the front cover-- a time capsule!

Good work on the identical-topic-name-in-same-forum rename, Philip.

I intend to continue with "my" '82 SD22-into-'86 gasser thread by posting here, unless you have an objection.

[philip]

SNIP- Good work on the identical-topic-name-in-same-forum rename, Philip.

I intend to continue with "my" '82 SD22-into-'86 gasser thread by posting here, unless you have an objection.

Wish I could stitch one to the other but ... necessity is the mother of invention .